Does AVN Have a Credibility Issue?

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

Originally Posted by Aly_AVN

Quote:
Originally Posted by kBizzle
half of these people do what they do for AVN for FREE PROMOTION- just like J STyles told me he'd be writing for you guys to promote his business- seems pretty cut and dried to me.

Doesnt it create Biased articles and content in doing so?

[Aly]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

no Aly I am telling the truth- I know it's something you rarely hear within the confines of your office or on this chatboard...

I know th etruth hurts, I can tell by the number of ICQ's and AIM's I am getting from chickenshits who won't post what they think but are silently loving this

The truth doesn't hurt me at all KB. Sorry to dampen your drama. I've been actively soliciting 'the truth' for six months now in order to improve the product and how it's received.

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

"Is offered up" sounds like they offer the articles. And I also wrote what they had printed.

So what trust did I give up?
Sounds like you are a little defensive to me

Kevin,

If I talk to you in private about something - ANYTHING ... and you mention it on the boards - it's not YOUR place, man!

Do you seriously NOT get that?

Would you expect me to talk on the boards about your trip last week? It's not my place. You told me details about that in private, right?

Apologize and be done.

[TheGoldenChild]

Originally Posted by DonovanPhillips

I'd have to say that's how I took it. kB is right about that one. "Is offered up" = "was written by" to me.


Now... can we PLEASE talk about why this story was printed???????????

Donny I know we haven't seen eye to eye in the past- but I agree with you on that one- It sounded to me as if Aly was telling us about articles being written by web know-it-alls-

As far as Jonathon being touchy about me saying he was writing for AVN- I think that may have more to do about his guilty conscience considering a dear friend of his for a lot of years is currently suing the same people who's ass J Styles apparently appears to be ass kissing for his own self promotion to sell content.

More power to him, what Jonathon doesn't know is that I told a friend of mine of 17 yrs today to go fuck himself as well- and funny enough he is the Publisher of AVN Online- go figure.
One I considered to be like a brother

"Fredo, you broke my heart"

[TheGoldenChild]

Originally Posted by J$tyle$

Kevin,

If I talk to you in private about something - ANYTHING ... and you mention it on the boards - it's not YOUR place, man!

Do you seriously NOT get that?

Would you expect me to talk on the boards about your trip last week? It's not my place. You told me details about that in private, right?

Apologize and be done.

Talk all you fucking want Jonathon- my life is an open book.

That's what you don't get- I DON'T CARE. I do for everyone and help everybody. I am not a leech, nor do I need anyone to pay my bills for me.

I will continue to tell the truth and score my karma points daily so I can sleep with myself at night. When I say I don't like something that is my right-
It's your right to disagree.

I don't recall our conversation about you writing for an adult trade magazine being something that may jeopardize the security of the nation

Jeez man- get off your high horse for a moment. This is a business, albeit a very unprofessional one.

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by DonovanPhillips

No high horse. I'm just saying you need to write about something you know, which is marketing. You don't know the content business. That's a fact. There's nothing to argue about there. And there's nothing wrong with admitting you know nothing about the content business. You know marketing, which is probably the single most important part of this (and any) industry. Write about marketing. I would LOVE to learn what you know.

So, will you be writing about marketing, or content?

How did you learn to sidestep on a high horse, Donny? You do it well!

LOL

The fact is that there is a lot I know about the content business that has nothing to do with shooting. You live in a "bubble" that YOU THINK is the Content business.

IT'S NOT JUST THAT BUBBLE!



I think I'll write about Content

[Aly]

Donovan, sorry, now to answer your initial question..! AVN does stand behind it's story. It was not made up, and that was indeed how the information was presented to the writer. I strongly suggest that anyone who has any business concerns about this issue contact their ccbill rep though; that's simply the smart thing to do.

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

Can I write an artical about Juicy?

[hollymoss]

It is SAD how things have turned out between US.
Us meaning the veterans in the industry!! ( friends4ever ??)

? But I guess it is just the evolution of business. As saying goes ? ?It is not personal it is just business?. Can?t say it does not HURT.

Who would have guessed back in 1996 ? we would FAST FORWARD year 2005
and see posts on board like this!!

Don?t really have any amazing last remarks ? But I wish everybody well.

hmoss

[Aly]

Originally Posted by AlienQ

Can I write an artical about Juicy?

I can think of nothing more compelling!

[Aly]

Originally Posted by hollymoss

It is SAD how things have turned out between US.
Us meaning the veterans in the industry!! ( friends4ever ??)

? But I guess it is just the evolution of business. As saying goes ? ?It is not personal it is just business?. Can?t say it does not HURT.

Who would have guessed back in 1996 ? we would FAST FORWARD year 2005
and see posts on board like this!!

Don?t really have any amazing last remarks ? But I wish everybody well.

hmoss

Thanks Holly. I agree it's sad.

[Donny]

Originally Posted by J$tyle$

How did you learn to sidestep on a high horse, Donny? You do it well!

LOL

The fact is that there is a lot I know about the content business that has nothing to do with shooting. You live in a "bubble" that YOU THINK is the Content business.

IT'S NOT JUST THAT BUBBLE!



I think I'll write about Content

Hearing stories from content providers does not equal knowing about the content business.

I will be the first to admit I'm not an expert in the content business. I am an expert on shooting soft core content in Chico, California. That is all. Beyond the I know virtually nothing.

But you see, I can admit my lack of knowledge of other areas. I am highly annoyed by those who's egos don't let them admit when they don't know jack schitt about a subject.

You know about marketing. You are a marketing genius. You don't know content. At all. You may know stories about shooting content, but you do not know content.

Lose the ego and admit it. Then write about marketing.

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

Donny I know we haven't seen eye to eye in the past- but I agree with you on that one- It sounded to me as if Aly was telling us about articles being written by web know-it-alls-

As far as Jonathon being touchy about me saying he was writing for AVN- I think that may have more to do about his guilty conscience considering a dear friend of his for a lot of years is currently suing the same people who's ass J Styles apparently appears to be ass kissing for his own self promotion to sell content.

More power to him, what Jonathon doesn't know is that I told a friend of mine of 17 yrs today to go fuck himself as well- and funny enough he is the Publisher of AVN Online- go figure.
One I considered to be like a brother

"Fredo, you broke my heart"

Spin, spin, spin!

[TheGoldenChild]

Jonathan, you flew off the handle and pulled a trust issue.

The only thing you told me was about the writing thing which I never mentioned until Aly did.

Even Donovan understood what you said the same way as I did.

I figured the cat was out of the bag. Why are you hiding it? No reason to make me out like the bad guy.

You owe ME the apology. I'm sure lot's of people would think the same way based on the words Aly chose.

Why would I even think there's a secret behind that?

This is a dumb argument.

But really, you're wrong.

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by DonovanPhillips

Hearing stories from content providers does not equal knowing about the content business.

I will be the first to admit I'm not an expert in the content business. I am an expert on shooting soft core content in Chico, California. That is all. Beyond the I know virtually nothing.

But you see, I can admit my lack of knowledge of other areas. I am highly annoyed by those who's egos don't let them admit when they don't know jack schitt about a subject.

You know about marketing. You are a marketing genius. You don't know content. At all. You may know stories about shooting content, but you do not know content.

Lose the ego and admit it. Then write about marketing.

SHOOTING CONTENT IS NOT THE BE ALL END ALL TO THE CONTENT BUSINESS!

Come out of your softcore, Chico, CA BUBBLE, Donny and realize that that content business is a BUSINESS and there's more to it than being a photographer... I mentioned 3 other aspects that i could write about which you disregarded and side stepped.

I'm not saying I'm an EXPERT at shooting content.

There are 10 other aspects of the business I could write about which would be informative or entertaining .

This has nothing to do with ego on my part ... it's BUSINESS!

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

Jonathan, you flew off the handle and pulled a trust issue.

The only thing you told me was about the writing thing which I never mentioned until Aly did.

Even Donovan understood what you said the same way as I did.

I figured the cat was out of the bag. Why are you hiding it? No reason to make me out like the bad guy.

You owe ME the apology. I'm sure lot's of people would think the same way based on the words Aly chose.

Why would I even think there's a secret behind that?

This is a dumb argument.

But really, you're wrong.

Ok, I'm sorry you have a big mouth.

[TheGoldenChild]

http://www.avn.com/index.php?Primary...tent_ID=226900

Speaking about back peddling-
Why did AVN just find out recently about these people when they had given them 3 stars on some reviews in the past?

One word, GREED

[XPays]

Originally Posted by hollymoss

It is SAD how things have turned out between US.
Us meaning the veterans in the industry!! ( friends4ever ??)

? But I guess it is just the evolution of business. As saying goes ? ?It is not personal it is just business?. Can?t say it does not HURT.

Who would have guessed back in 1996 ? we would FAST FORWARD year 2005
and see posts on board like this!!

Don?t really have any amazing last remarks ? But I wish everybody well.

hmoss

you are making me feel old

[Donny]

Jon,

You're showing how large your ego is in this thread, not only with the posts you're making to me but with those to kB as well.

You know how to MARKET content. You do not know CONTENT. *I* have been shooting and marketing content for 8 years and I will admit, as I already said, that I know NOTHING beyond MY SMALL PART in the content business. It takes a large ego to write about something you do not know as if you do. You've made a lot of money selling content. That was made by your MARKETING genius.

You...

...do...

...NOT...

...know...

content.

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

Originally Posted by hollymoss

It is SAD how things have turned out between US.
Us meaning the veterans in the industry!! ( friends4ever ??)

? But I guess it is just the evolution of business. As saying goes ? ?It is not personal it is just business?. Can?t say it does not HURT.

Who would have guessed back in 1996 ? we would FAST FORWARD year 2005
and see posts on board like this!!

Don?t really have any amazing last remarks ? But I wish everybody well.

hmoss

Nice post Holly.

Aly, enough of the "Darling" already, it sounds contrived and condescending.

KB, Donovan and J$tyles...put your egos at ease.

Tomorrow is another day to be a better human being. Approach it that way and see if it makes a difference, because your quibbling doesn't.

ADG Webmaster

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

Oh shit the whole family in da house now.
Lets make it a real moment;)

[Aly]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

Jonathan, you flew off the handle and pulled a trust issue.

The only thing you told me was about the writing thing which I never mentioned until Aly did.

Even Donovan understood what you said the same way as I did.

I figured the cat was out of the bag. Why are you hiding it? No reason to make me out like the bad guy.

You owe ME the apology. I'm sure lot's of people would think the same way based on the words Aly chose.

Why would I even think there's a secret behind that?

This is a dumb argument.

But really, you're wrong.

KB, THIS is what Jon was pissed about:
"Originally Posted by kBizzle
... just like J STyles told me he'd be writing for you guys to promote his business- seems pretty cut and dried to me. "

Read it. Get it now?

Spinning this back on someone else is NOT honest at all.

Can we all stop and go to bed soon?

[newbreed]

Aly did you catch my question on Page 2?

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

I think the real problem right now is that KB is realising this biz is actually loaded with folks that do not give a fuck. Its not a industry where we look out for each other, we cut each others throats day and night and the realisation of it is pretty tough.

Being steeped on, helping elevate folks and generally putting forward anything goes without any compensation. None.

Many people that put companies on the map are broke, missing or just end nowhere after putting every ounce of what they got into them.

This is a repetive and recurring tragedy for many and most people in this biz.

Its a tough pill to swallow.

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

I am watching a friendship shatter right now before my eyes.

Fucken unreal.

[TheGoldenChild]

Originally Posted by AlienQ

I think the real problem right now is that KB is realising this biz is actually loaded with folks that do not give a fuck. Its not a industry where we look out for each other, we cut each others throats day and night and the realisation of it is pretty tough.

Being steeped on, helping elevate folks and generally putting forward anything goes without any compensation. None.

Many people that put companies on the map are broke, missing or just end nowhere after putting every ounce of what they got into them.

This is a repetive and recurring tragedy for many and most people in this biz.

Its a tough pill to swallow.

Amen. It's a shame but it's the truth

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by DonovanPhillips

Jon,

You're showing how large your ego is in this thread, not only with the posts you're making to me but with those to kB as well.

You know how to MARKET content. You do not know CONTENT. *I* have been shooting and marketing content for 8 years and I will admit, as I already said, that I know NOTHING beyond MY SMALL PART in the content business. It takes a large ego to write about something you do not know as if you do. You've made a lot of money selling content. That was made by your MARKETING genius.

You...

...do...

...NOT...

...know...

content.

Donny, go back to my posts and read them carefully - you'll see that the majority of what's said is with tongue firmly in cheek



Other than that, you're starting to sound like a broken record.

BTW - I'm not marketing genius.

How's that for no ego?

[D-Money]

oy vey

unreal

[Donny]

Originally Posted by D-Money

oy vey

unreal

I've never once attended a player's ball. The marketing for it has never appealed to me enough to actually go. I usually just go to bed instead.

;)

Edit to add: Dude, you edited that fast! I was replying to you saying you're a marketing genius. LOL

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by Aly_AVN

KB, THIS is what Jon was pissed about:
"Originally Posted by kBizzle
... just like J STyles told me he'd be writing for you guys to promote his business- seems pretty cut and dried to me. "

Read it. Get it now?

Spinning this back on someone else is NOT honest at all.

Can we all stop and go to bed soon?

Aly,

I'm not pissed at KB at all.

Maybe I was a little upset in the begining when I read his post, but I'm not holding any grudges against him.



I am dissappoiinted that he took something I said to him, misquoted me and posted it publicly on an industry message board. If he doesn't understand that's what happened, I'm not going to try any further to convince him, and we can all move on happily.

As far as i'm concerned, nothing has changed regarding our friendship. I just need to be more mindful of what I say to him regarding what I do in my business.

[TheGoldenChild]

two things that need to be mentioned

1) AVN has a credibility issue and that was what the thread is all about

2) Donny - I am a marketing genius, J Styles gives away content for pennies on the dollar.

[Donny]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

two things that need to be mentioned

1) AVN has a credibility issue and that was what the thread is all about

2) Donny - I am a marketing genius, J Styles gives away content for pennies on the dollar.

[TheGoldenChild]

Originally Posted by J$tyle$

Aly,

I'm not pissed at KB at all.

Maybe I was a little upset in the begining when I read his post, but I'm not holding any grudges against him.



I am dissappoiinted that he took something I said to him, misquoted me and posted it publicly on an industry message board. If he doesn't understand that's what happened, I'm not going to try any further to convince him, and we can all move on happily.

As far as i'm concerned, nothing has changed regarding our friendship. I just need to be more mindful of what I say to him regarding what I do in my business.

Better yet do me a favor and don't call me if you cannot trust me-
Especially if the information is so inflammatory it's going to chap your ass

I mean- is this something that you consider to be so covert that you are writing for AVN Online for free?

Come on Jonathon if we were talking about banging hookers at a tradeshow I can understand not wanting to have that information posted publically-

But this- get real man- It's so fucking dumb

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

I have never bangd a hooker at trade show

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

two things that need to be mentioned

1) AVN has a credibility issue and that was what the thread is all about

2) Donny - I am a marketing genius, J Styles gives away content for pennies on the dollar.

Kevin,

Shameless self promotion does not make you a marketing genius.

Talk about ego!

[Sly]

I banged a tranny midget at a show once. A BIG time sponsor paid for it. How scandalous!

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

Better yet do me a favor and don't call me if you cannot trust me-
Especially if the information is so inflammatory it's going to chap your ass

I mean- is this something that you consider to be so covert that you are writing for AVN Online for free?

Come on Jonathon if we were talking about banging hookers at a tradeshow I can understand not wanting to have that information posted publically-

But this- get real man- It's so fucking dumb

spin spin spin

[European Lee]

Sup peeps

Does AVN have credibility issues?

Probably but then, ask anyone on GFY about any other GFY'er and the chances are, everyone has something bad to say about everyone.

Are AVN money grabbing SOB's when it comes to their mag and the tradeshows, course they are, they are running a business.

Do i think its right that they charge so much for mag ads, tradeshow booths and sponsored events at the shows? Hell no but, if i dont like their prices, i dont have to pay them

Bizzle, hows things bro?

Styles, hows that wifey and kiddo of yours doing?

Regards,

Lee

[European Lee]

Originally Posted by Sly

I banged a tranny midget at a show once. A BIG time sponsor paid for it. How scandalous!

How was Juicy?

Regards,

Lee

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

Tranny midget?!? Ewww...

ADG Webmaster

[Donny]

Regards Lee!

Regards,

- D -

[European Lee]

Originally Posted by DonovanPhillips

Regards Lee!

Regards,

- D -

Sup retard

Regards,

Lee

[D-Money]

Originally Posted by DonovanPhillips

I've never once attended a player's ball. The marketing for it has never appealed to me enough to actually go. I usually just go to bed instead.

;)

Edit to add: Dude, you edited that fast! I was replying to you saying you're a marketing genius. LOL

The truth is that KB is over at my place and types in the browser that has my handle on it. Then he goes back and edits it with smileys or oy veys.

[Donny]

Originally Posted by D-Money

The truth is that KB is over at my place and types in the browser that has my handle on it. Then he goes back and edits it with smileys or oy veys.

Ah, okay. That makes sense. I thought I was going crazy there for a second when I saw him write almost the exact same thing that you removed.

[Donny]

Originally Posted by European Lee

Sup retard

Regards,

Lee

Still piratin'?

(were you at Phoenix Forum '04)

[SleazyDream]

Originally Posted by Aly_AVN

I wasn't around for a lot of things, darling. But I'm here now. The staff has changed, the attitude has changed and the magazine has changed.

Granted, things around here don't change as fast as your business card does, but they do actually change.

i kinda agree - I've sceen changes in AVN - in business model and attitude in the last year. I'm not going so far as to say AVN is perfect- but I - as someone who used to refer to AVN as an untouchable monster - can at least say that in the last year esp AVN is approachable and receptitive to ideas. Not all worked - no business has every idea go perfect - but at least I do see them trying and i give AVN credit for that.

[jonesy]

Originally Posted by AlienQ

I think the real problem right now is that KB is realising this biz is actually loaded with folks that do not give a fuck. Its not a industry where we look out for each other, we cut each others throats day and night and the realisation of it is pretty tough.

Being steeped on, helping elevate folks and generally putting forward anything goes without any compensation. None.

Many people that put companies on the map are broke, missing or just end nowhere after putting every ounce of what they got into them.

This is a repetive and recurring tragedy for many and most people in this biz.

Its a tough pill to swallow.

WELCOME TO A THING CALLED LIFE.

[TheGoldenChild]

Spin Spin Spin?

You wigged out for no reason Jonathon- you are extremely touchy.
and YES I AM A MARKETING GENIUS

When you see my movie coming out next year you will all see true brilliance- and YES I do have an ego it's one of the reasons why 20/20 , NY Times, and a myriad of other media call me every sweeps week

Remember the VH-1 special and Channel 4 interviews I got you in?

:-))

[Donny]

Once i was sitting on the toilet surfing the 'net on my Powerbook G4 and I thought, "damn, it's so cool to be able to do business while doing business..."

that was actually just a few hours ago

[J$tyle$]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

Spin Spin Spin?

You wigged out for no reason Jonathon- you are extremely touchy.
and YES I AM A MARKETING GENIUS

When you see my movie coming out next year you will all see true brilliance- and YES I do have an ego it's one of the reasons why 20/20 , NY Times, and a myriad of other media call me every sweeps week

Remember the VH-1 special and Channel 4 interviews I got you in?

:-))

We can agree to disagree about all the aforementioned, Kevin!



And, I've always expressed my appreciation regarding the VH-1 and BBC gigs.

WE HAD A LOT OF FUN WITH THOSE!



BTW - I just got a call from Toby and Simon's production company today regarding another piece they want to do! Did you hear from them?